Log in

[icon] Vergil Repeats Himself - The latin community
View:Recent Entries.
View:Website (The Perseus Project).

Subject:Vergil Repeats Himself
Time:10:46 am
1.) Eclogues 4.48-52:

Adgredere o magnos (aderit iam tempus) honores,
cara deum suboles, magnum Iovis incrementum!
Aspice convexo nutantem pondere mundum,
terrasque tractusque maris caelumque profundum;
aspice, venturo laetentur ut omnia saeclo!

2.) Georgics 4.219-227:

His quidam signis atque haec exempla secuti
esse apibus partem divinae mentis et haustus
aetherios dixere; deum namque ire per omnes
terrasque tractusque maris caelumque profundum.
Hinc pecudes, armenta, viros, genus omne ferarum,
quemque sibi tenues nascentem arcessere vitas;
scilicet huc reddi deinde ac resoluta referri
omnia nec morti esse locum, sed viva volare
sideris in numerum atque alto succedere caelo.

I'm sure he did this more often than just once. Is there a list of all his self-quotes? (Or do you happen to know other examples?)

EDIT: Apparently there's an old (1881) Hermes article by E. Albrecht "Wiederholte Verse und Verstheile bei Vergil". I'll try to find that.
comments: Leave a comment Previous Entry Share Next Entry

Time:2013-07-02 11:28 am (UTC)
The identity/similarity of some lines in the Aristaeus/Orpheus episode with lines in the Aeneid has been used to 'prove' that Georgics 4 as we have it was a second revision, undertaken after the beginning of the composition of the Aeneid in order to eliminate the so-called Laudes Galli (i.e. the argument is: V. repeated lines in the revised version of Geo. 4 from the Aeneid). You list the lines which are identical. There are others which are not identical but are sufficiently close to establish that the one unmistakeably depends on the other.

This is a list of those which are felt to be significant.

Aen. 1.126 ~ Geo. 4.352
Aen. 1.701-6 ~ Geo. 4.376-9
Aen. 1.159-69 ~ Geo. 4.418-23
Aen. 6.309-15 ~ Geo. 4.473-7
Aen. 2.790-4 ~ Geo. 4.499-502

One more to add to the list, I think, is

Aen. 1.677-9 ~ Geo. 4.354-6

Regius accitu cari genitoris ad urbem
Sidoniam puer ire parat, mea maxima cura,
dona ferens, pelago et flammis restantia Troiae:
(Aen. 1.677-9)

Cyrene soror, ipse tibi, tua maxima cura,
tristis Aristaeus Penei genitoris ad undam 355
stat lacrimans et te crudelem nomine dicit.'
(Geo. 354-6)

For the Laudes Galli: see Servius on Ecl. 10.1 and on Geo. 4.1: to the effect that Georgics IV originally contained praise of Gallus (the poet, commander of part of Octavian's army's in the Alexandrian campaign and first prefect of Egypt) which were deleted and replaced with the Aristaeus and Orpheus episode following Gallus' mysterious disgrace, prosecution and suicide in BC 26 or BC 27.

Although Servius here is now widely discredited, I myself think that the report is essentially true. But I very much doubt that the 'proof' is to be found in these 'doublets' not least (i) Vergilian self-repetition is such a wide phenomenon; (ii) determining precedence is entirely subjective and hazardous; and (iii) there remains the distinct possibility that the 'doublets' in fact share common (lost) models - so arguing from how well the respective lines fit in context may be to proceed on a false premise.

If you are interested (or anyone else is...!):

Bibliography on the Laudes Galli - include:

Anderson, W. B. (1933) "Gallus and the 4th Georgic" CQ 27 pp. 36-45; Anderson, W. B. (1933) "Gallus and the Fourth Georgic: Addendum" CQ 27 p. 73 (1933)
Norden, E. (1934) 'Orpheus und Eurydice' SPAW 626-683 = Kleine Schriften (1966) Berlin pp. 468-532
Jocelyn, H. D. (1984) 'Servius and the second edition of the Georgics' in 'Atti del Convegno mondiale scientifico di studi su Virgilio, Mantova/Roma/Napoli 19-24 settembre 1981' Milan pp. 431-438
Nosarti, L. (1996) 'Studi sulle Georgiche di Virgilio' Padova

Bibliography specifically on the Laudes Galli and the Georgics IV doublets include:

Otis, B. (1963) 'Virgil: A Study in Civilized Poetry' Oxford (one of the Appendices)
Coleiro, E. (1971) 'Allegory in the Fourth Georgic' in Bardon and Verdiere (edd.) 'Vergiliana: Recherches sur Virgile' Leiden pp.
Paratore, E. (1977) 'L'Episodio di Orfeo' in 'Atti del Convegno Virgiliano bimellenario delle Georgiche' pp. 9-36
Setaioli, A. (1998) 'Novies Styx interfusa: Aen. 6.439-Georg. 4.480' in 'Si tantus amor... Studi Virgiliani' Bologna at pp. 105-120
(Reply) (Parent) (Thread)

Time:2013-07-03 02:24 pm (UTC)
Ah, thank you! I knew the story about the laudes Galli, but had forgotten.

I'm glad that we've got the Aristaeus-Orpheus passage now, because it's wonderful (and Gallus is praised in the equally wonderful Eclogue X anyway). Also I agree with you that the doublets don't prove much. Do they mean that Vergil used those lines twice because he was too lazy to write something new to replace the laudes? That certainly doesn't fit into my picture of him.
(Reply) (Parent) (Thread)

Time:2013-07-04 02:27 pm (UTC)
'Do they mean that Vergil used those lines twice because he was too lazy to write something new to replace the laudes?'

That is more or less the implication, although it's couched more politely! In a similar vein, some adherents of the Laudes Galli testimony have argued that they detect signs of imperfect revision, as if Vergil would not be capable or would not take the care to complete properly a revised edition (although, in fact, there are some interesting oddities about the composition and an intriguing textual oddity at lines 4.290-3 (describing Egypt - i.e. pertinent to Gallus) - they appear in a different order in each of our three oldest texts of Vergil).
(Reply) (Parent) (Thread)

[icon] Vergil Repeats Himself - The latin community
View:Recent Entries.
View:Website (The Perseus Project).